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By Omoniyi Salaudeen
Senator Adeseye Ogunlewe combines legislative and executive experience as a former member of the National Assembly and one-time Minister for Works and Housing.
In this interview, he examined the new reform policies of President Bola Ahmed Tinubu, his much-anticipated cabinet, and how things can be done differently.
He also dismissed the resolution of the House of Representatives urging the Federal Government to prevail on some universities that have increased students’ tuition fees to revert to the old rate immediately as a waste of time.
What are your expectations of the 10th National Assembly under the new leadership?
I expect speedy passage of laws that will support the new policies of President Bola Ahmed Tinubu. They should formulate and pass laws that will assist the government in pursuing those policies. They must rise up to the occasion and assist the President in achieving his aims and objectives under the manifesto of the ruling All Progressives Congress (APC). We should not celebrate poverty again. And it is the law passed by the National Assembly that can assist Mr President to reduce poverty in Nigeria. For instance, if we have a good policy on education, it will assist parents in buying books, uniforms, and other educational materials for their children in primary school. Free health services must be available for the citizens. Housing schemes must be available for the citizens. There are so many other things the government can do to reduce poverty in the nation.
And how easy would that be under the kind of a rainbow coalition in both chambers?
I am very confident that they will do the bidding of the party. The party should be the one dictating what the National Assembly should do because APC has the majority. They should pass the law that will alleviate poverty in the country.
Is that not a looming danger of another rubberstamp National Assembly?
If they are going to protect the integrity of the party, what not? They must rubberstamp every policy of the party that is in their manifesto.
Is it the interest of the nation that is paramount now or the interest of the party?
What is paramount is the manifesto presented to the electorate by the party. They voted for them on the basis of the manifesto of the party. So, that is what should be the guiding principle in whatever they want to do.
But where the manifesto runs counter to the interest of the nation, which one takes precedence?
They will amend the law to allow the policy of the party to prevail. People voted for the party on the basis of the manifesto presented to them. That is what everybody must comply with.
The new bill on scholarships for students in tertiary institutions is seen in some quarters as a smokescreen for the imposition of higher fees on students. What are your thoughts on this?
They have to pass another law. If you are very brilliant, the Federal Government must give you a scholarship. If you are a middle-level performer, then you can go and borrow money for education. If you have rich parents, you must pay school fees. That will be the new order. Children of rich people should not be entitled to loans, but they should be able to pay commensurable value for their children’s education. That is what is obtainable anywhere in the world. Our children go out of Nigeria to study and pay for it. So, why can’t the rich pay for their children’s university education?
How do you draw the line of demarcation between the children of the rich and the children of the poor?
It is their basic income. It is going to be compulsory to fill out a form from the Federal Inland Revenue Service through NIN. If you have X amount, you should be able to pay for the university education of your children. If you earn less than N50,000 per year, then you go on loan.
Are you aware that the House of Representatives has already passed a resolution urging the Federal Government to ask those universities that have hiked their fees to revert to the old rates?
That resolution cannot hold water. They are just wasting time. When you pass a law that students should be given loans, how do you now pass a resolution that those who want to pay school fees should not pay? If you are a rich person, you must be able to send your child to school at your own expense.
What is your take on President Tinubu’s reform policies coming so rapidly within the short time of his assumption of office?
I read in the newspaper that the Federal Government paid over N9 trillion in 30 months on fuel subsidies. Let the Federal Government aggregate all these monies and invest them in the provision of electricity for everybody. Lack of electricity is the bane on our economy. That is why we cannot industrialise, that is why homes are not settled and businesses cannot thrive. If they can provide 24-hour electricity, it is enough for us. We must do something drastic in this country for us to develop. We cannot continue like this. We have to give people hope. We have to do something drastic to change the economy of this country. Let us invest massively in electricity generation. That is what developed countries have done. We must have a primary health centre in every ward so that people can have access to medical care for small ailments like malaria. Everybody must have access to housing at the expense of the government and it is doable. If the Federal Government can use the money withdrawn from fuel subsidy for the benefit of the masses, they will not complain. It is the rich people that are complaining. Let the government provide massive buses and provide them with tickets at rebate rates, they will not complain. How the money realized will be spent is what is of concern to most Nigerians. Once they see that the government is using the money wisely, they will be contented.
Why couldn’t the government wait to provide these palliatives before the sudden removal?
Where do you get the money to do all these palliatives if you don’t stop it? Let us give them another three months and then ask them to tell us what they have realized from the removal of subsidy so that they can invest it in the welfare of the people.
There is a lot of anxiety about the composition of Tinubu’s cabinet. Would you support the idea of giving preference to technocrats at the expense of career politicians like the former governors who were part of the campaign activities that gave the APC its victory in the last election?
There are many technocrats who are politicians too. They are even in the majority. So, this concept of the technocrat is alien to me. It is as if none of the politicians went to university. We all went to the same university. How can they now say we are not technocrats? The President we have is an exceptionally clever person. There is nothing he would do that he would not have a policy framework. He will set up a committee that will formulate policies for him. It is for the ministers to implement them. He will never allow any minister to formulate any policy for his government. The minister will only implement the policies that are already prepared by him. That will be the difference. So, there is no fear at all. He will make sure that those appointed key into the policies of the party. He will not allow any minister to derail his administration as was done with the last dispensation.
From the point of view of the current state of the economy, are you looking at a lean government as a way of reducing the cost of governance or the usual over-bloated structure that allows for several appointees?
It is a constitutional matter; he must choose one minister per state, one from the Federal Capital Territory, and one per geo-political zone. That is the limit he can go. And he cannot reduce it.
Security is pivotal to all of the reforms you have suggested. What kind of strategic approach would you suggest as a way of dealing with the seemingly insurmountable challenge of insecurity in the country?
Under the Firearm Act, every responsible Nigerian is entitled to firearms to defend himself. For eight years of the Buhari administration, this was cancelled. That was what exposed individuals and communities to bandits’ attacks. We have to review that. Let responsible Nigerians be given a licence to carry arms to defend themselves. All the vigilante groups also should be enlisted into the Civil Defence Corps and be given arms. It is undemocratic and inhuman to allow bandits to attack and carry people away like bags of rice. Give me a firearm, I will sign. Once there is an attack, I fight back. We should not leave Nigerians to the whims and caprices of the bandits. Nigerians must be allowed to protect themselves.
You seem to be giving preference to self-help than the formal security system allowed by law?
It is not self-help, but self-preservation. You must be able to defend yourself. That was what was obtainable before Buhari came to power. Before Buhari came to power, the police were giving licences to people. If bandits know that Nigerians can carry arms, they will not be attacking people indiscriminately because they can’t know your firepower.
You are one of the advocates of restructuring. If your position still stands, will it not be better to be looking in the direction of the creation of state police instead of licensing individuals to carry arms?
It will be too complex if you go to the area of state police now because of the cosmopolitan nature of some cities. For instance, in Lagos, there are too many tribes. How do you want to key all of them into your state police? Is it going to be an indigene-based state police? Let us leave the issue of state police for the future. Instead, let more people enroll in civil defence and be given arms and ammunition. Then, allow individuals to carry AK47s as it is done in Israel. If the bandits know that you are capable of attacking them, they will not attack you. But because they know we are defenceless, they attack us and kill us anyhow.
