Follow Us on Google
By Daniel Kanu
Respected scholar, Prof Lai Olurode was former dean, Faculty of Social Science, University of Lagos and former national commissioner of Independent National Electoral Commission (INEC).
The renowned academic in this exclusive chat with Sunday Sun spoke on the new electoral law and its loopholes, women’s protest at the National Assembly over low representation, the Nigerian condition, committee 2022, including the Russian-Ukraine face-off, among other sensitive national issues. Excerpts:
Let’s start with your take on the new Electoral Act and the loopholes you observed?
You cannot have any piece of legislation that is meant to be evergreen. It is not meant to be relevant at all times because it’s not your Bible; it’s not your Koran. So there is nothing bad, so far so good and the loopholes shouldn’t be a challenge because society continues to evolve, will continue to improve. We are here today, tomorrow things will be different from what we thought and there will be a need to respond to the dynamics of change. What is important is that there is an improvement in the previous legislation. Look at the one on the women in terms of representation, they (women) are protesting on low representation and I understand the National Assembly, particularly, the House of Representatives is taking a look at it again. So, that is the way of life. Today, you punish an offence; tomorrow it seizes to be an offence. So, to cut the story short what we have is good if all stakeholders decide to play by the rules. What we have so far is good, but not perfect as no legislation can be perfect. As I have noted in a platform what we need to contain is the human angle. Of course, you know there is the human element that may want to subvert even the best legislation. There is this issue being generated on Section 84 (12) for which the president is seeking its review and I understand the Senate has turned it down. It is the position that some political appointees of government should resign first before they can take part in the primary to seek an elective office. The president is saying they need not resign, but not resigning many have argued will give them an advantage that is why the Senate is kicking against it. Of course, you know that some of the Senators also want to go back, the reason they are saying that they should first resign so as to be on the same level. You know being in government gives you an edge, leverage, you have security, you can intimidate, you have a lot of money also. So they are saying that if you want to be part of it, resign.
But the Senate promised President Buhari that they will consider his request on Section 84 (12)…?
(Cuts in) They must have said so genuinely, but now that they have again, critically looked into it, and on further reflection, they just felt it will not provide a level playing field, it will give some people an undue advantage, standing on a higher pedestal. So, why will you want to empower your potential enemies? It doesn’t make sense. Look at the Ebonyi State governor (Umahi), he traded off what the people gave to him. If the people knew they were going to cross to the APC they probably would not have used their franchise to elect him. He gets there, he now dumps the party, and he still want to continue to remain as the governor. If the people wanted to vote for the APC they would have expressed such with their votes, but they did not. So, why jump to the party the people in their majority refused to vote into power? They want to eat from both sides of the mouth, we shouldn’t allow it. They should stop taking the people for granted. Let’s wait and see how the Supreme Court will handle it. If we want to sanitize the parties, if we want to enthrone democracy in our parties, if we want the parties to be disciplined then we must stop certain things, certain fraudulent actions. Look at what the former Imo State governor (Okorocha) did, dumped the party, then went to APC, so if you don’t get the presidency you are going to abandon the party again? People trusted you and voted for you on a political platform of their choice. If they knew that you will dump their party they would not have voted for you. Afterall APC was there and they did not vote for the party, so why should you now take them to a party they did not want to belong to? Look at the Edo man (Godwin Obaseki) dumping the APC for the PDP, they are just looking for greener pasture anywhere, they have no shame. We have to rise up against some of these things and bring sanity to our parties and politics.
As you noted in passing earlier, the Nigerian women are protesting on how the bills that will elevate their position were all shotdown at the National Assembly. But do you think they have the capacity for what they are agitating for, more representation?
What do you mean by capacity? Today? Where do you get the likes of Okonjo Iweala? There are so many prominent women that abound in this country. As far back as the 1930s, 1940s they were there. Women? Women are stronger than men, yes, they play multiple roles, they cook for us, they are there in the formal and informal sectors of the economy. Look, if you refuse to educate and empower your women they won’t have the capacity, they won’t have what it takes to train your children and you are going to have a population of children that will be stark illiterates, they will lack the dexterity of doing things at home, even in the school. Women are not of the inferior brain at all, it was biological prejudices, social prejudices etc, that in the past discriminated against women and subjected them to the fringes of the society as irrelevant, as unnecessary. The discrimination against women is irrelevant, uncalled for and should be properly addressed. If our women decide not to go to farms, if they decide not to farm in the cottage industry, you will have no oil on your table to cook, you will have nothing like vegetables, they venture to the cultivation of commercial crops, so we need women all the way round, they cover so many areas, in nursing, the caregiving industry. When the men, children are down who takes care of them? Women form a great number of the population and you cannot afford to stand on one leg, neglecting the women, not adequately giving them the opportunity to school, to become professionals and express the stuff they are made off. If you go to many universities now, women are doing so great, going away with the best prizes better than the boys. Our boys are becoming wayward, look at their dressing these days. In some of the courses in our higher institutions, the girls have taken charge, the boys are not there. Each time I look into the lecture room, the classroom, I see more girls, more women who are ready to respond to what you are teaching; ready to participate in classroom work more than boys. And these girls will end up marrying some of these boys that are unserious, who are doing yahoo-yahoo, who cannot recognise that there are jobs, who cannot think of what they can do legitimately. Generally, I am not sure the output of women will not surpass the output of the men.
Most Nigerians appear to be hopeless pointing to the situation on the ground, the Nigerian condition. What is your take on this?
Honestly, if I have had many more years to live, I will be 70 this year, I am not sure I will remain in this country, wherever you turn, there is frustration. But the amazing thing is that the challenges of this country are not insurmountable. The problem we have is getting the leadership right, I mean right leadership. We have the population and population is the market, some say the population is a liability and I say they are wrong. It appears our challenges have overwhelmed leadership, but it is because they are not putting the right people at the right places. If you give this country to a group of Americans and give them five to 10 years, you will be shocked at what they will turn this country into, it will become like America and people will return back to the country. It’s money, money, money we talk about here. What can you be in this country without money? You can’t be a counselor, Assembly member, federal lawmaker, governor without money. Am I qualified to be a councilor, yes, can I be elected as a councilor, no, because they will be expecting me to dish out money to them. Where do I get the money? God-fatherism everywhere. Look at the political party system; is there not enough indication that we are not getting it right? Look at the primaries, look at the APC, look at the PDP, what do you see there? Do you see any hope? There is nothing inspiring there and these people will now recruit leaders through fraudulent practices. They won’t allow internal party democracy to function. How can you then build a country on that? If everything has to be by moneybag how can you get it right? They are the ones that will determine who the councilor of your area will be, who the chairman will be, who the House of Reps member or your senator will be. From the bottom to the top they are the ones to determine, it’s devastating, and it’s hopelessness. Look at what some ministers are doing, some are trying, but some are a mess. Look at what Oloyede is doing in JAMB. Look at Dr. Ngige (Labour Minister), he is somebody I respect, he knows what is wrong, look at the Minister of Education. Ordinarily, Nigeria should be a harvest of celebration, a country where many more people, you go, you galvanise, you go through, there are opportunities. Everywhere you turn to, whatever you touch in Nigeria is gold. Look at the Indians who come to this country they are sad when they come, but when they are going back they smile. We need to get our leadership right, simple.
How do you see the Russian and Ukraine face-off?
Let me put it this way. If there is any small country, let’s take Africa, let’s take Togo or the Benin Republic, now being friendly with a country that we consider as an enemy. And look at the cooperation we have received from the Niger Republic, from Chad, from Cameroun, supposing we were not able to get them to be friendly with us and we are being attacked by Boko Haram, ISWAP, bandits etc, are you going to be comfortable? I don’t expect that Russia will be comfortable, folding its hands while Ukraine is being empowered. We are not yet there. The way the world operates now, what America will not tolerate is what they are asking Russia to tolerate. America will never allow any of its satellite countries in Latin America, for instance, to now want to be independent of America and become friendly with Russia, America will not stand it. There is this Yoruba proverb that, if your hand is not on the handle of the cutlass, never ask for what is the cause of the death of your father. I don’t think Ukraine has arrived at that age where it can remotely, indirectly, or otherwise challenge Russia to a fight. We are not yet in a world of civilization where force does not matter. There is nothing like independence of nations, in reality, there is nothing like non-interference, it is obvious on paper, it’s not workable. What we have in reality is the rule of force, intimidation, fear, that is the way the world is still arranged today.
There was this gathering of political and economic heavyweights recently under the aegis of Committee 2022. What is your take on the recipe that they are presenting to salvage the country?
All I know is that the conventional political parties that we have, as it is: the PDP, APC, and the other small parties, I think they are definitely overwhelmed by the challenges of governance, so it might be in that contest that can there be another window so that the country does not go under? If the country goes under, we are all in for it, where will millions of Nigerians run to? The environment seems to be hostile to any form of change, but we must not give up. I think any genuine effort to fix Nigeria should be welcomed. The resources we have in this country if we restructure and get our acts right we will not have any problem, it will go round. The North will survive, the West, East, South, Central, all will survive. We have enough, but for those that are greedy. If there is a third window, then let’s pursue it, so far it is for the best interest of the country and the people. The mainstream political parties certainly need a kind of intervention, not a military intervention, but there is a need for an alternative to what we are doing. Look at the cost of governance alone; the universities are paralyzed, how can you allow the university to go under?
That brings us to the latest question of the government constituting another committee on ASUU…?
(Cuts in) Does that make sense? When you had a peace agreement in 2009, you did not make progress to honour it and you now turn around dishing out another committee, for what? You can’t implement your own decision and agreement, which one did you experiment in the agreement to warrant the new development? ASUU will be naïve to go to the table; if ASUU goes to the table I will be surprised. To do what? Have you ever seen the National Assembly going on strike? They pad into the budget whatever they want. But, be that as it may, I still see light at the end of the tunnel. Look at the Second Niger Bridge, because of agitation from the Southeast, something is happening there. Look at the Lagos-Ibadan road, it’s getting better, look at the railway station, more and more parts of the country are being connected, more infrastructure being put in place etc, these are positive signals, but it’s just to let us know that it’s just a tip of the iceberg. We can do more because we have what it takes to be better than what we are today. As Lateef Jakande once told me: “Nigeria should be working for 24 hours. There should be no rest time for Nigeria.” We must be in a hurry to develop and to overcome our challenges because we are the largest population in Africa, over 200 million people; we cannot afford to waste that population.
