By Sunday Ani
Former General Secretary of the National Union of Petroleum and Natural Gas Workers (NUPENG), Chief Frank Kokori has lent his voice to those insisting that power must shift to the South in 2023 for the sake of equity, justice and fair play.
In this interview, the former labour leader spoke on a variety of national issues including the President’s delay in signing the amended electoral bill, the current fuel scarcity in the country, the current ASUU strike and the chances of the All Progressives Congress (APC) to retain power in 2023.
It is almost two weeks now that the National Assembly sent the Electoral Amendment Bill to the president for a second time for his assent, yet the President has not said anything about it. Nigerians are worried by the President’s silence; what is your take on that?
Just like every other Nigerian, I am also worried because I want the new electoral act to take off because of future elections. We really want free and fair elections; in other words, we want elections where people’s votes count. I am one of those who know that Nigerian elections have never been free and fair; there is so much rigging. All the major parties rig, so if the president signs the bill, I think that will minimize rigging in elections. So, we are all worried and I hope he will sign it; that’s all. I think he has up to 30 days to sign it; we are all waiting for the end of the 30 days but I think he will sign it.
Do you agree with those who insinuate that the president’s delay in signing the electoral amendment bill is a calculated attempt to undermine and rig the 2023 elections?
No, I don’t think the President will be so insincere not to sign the bill because the whole world would then believe that he is not a man of his words and he will be on the wrong side of history. I am sure he would like to be on the right side of history, especially when he came to power with that type of election. So, let’s wait until he does not sign and the normal institutions are there to check him. If the National Assembly members are worth their names, they would check him.
What do you think about the current fuel scarcity in Nigeria?
I think they have made that mistake and Nigerians have cried out that the culprits should be punished for what they have done. And I believe a good government should actually step into such matters and have some people punished to serve as a deterrent to official deals. It is a shame really but what can we do? So, that one will soon come to an end but the final thing I have always said is that Nigeria needs the refineries to work. In those days, I was against the privatisation of the refineries but now if there are good multinationals that can buy them, let them buy them and run them properly for Nigerians. Since Nigerians cannot run their refineries, they should sell them and make them public-private partnership where government and private people will have some shares, with the majority shares being owned by the private people. A big country like Nigeria should be able to refine its petroleum products and not buy everything from abroad. It is a shame. All my years in NUPENG, such things never happened. I don’t think all that rubbish would have happened if I was still in NUPENG, because when I retired from NUPENG, all the refineries were working and I know the efforts I always put into it and the roles I always played with the government to ensure that fuel pump price were not increased anyhow. I went to prison when the fuel pump price was N2.70k. It was about three months after I went to prison that Abacha increased it to N11 from N2.70k. I have always been involved with the government in fixing the fuel pump prices; that is me and my NUPENG. I know the value of the refineries and there is no way I should have been the head of the oil union and allow the refineries to go down. The type of fuel being brought to Nigeria now is not the type of fuel we had in the 80s when the Nigerian refineries were working. And I have always told people that the Warri Refinery was producing the best kerosene in the whole world but all those have gone. So, now we just buy fuel from black market anywhere in the world; cheap fuel and it is dangerous to the country.
Your party, the APC, promised to end the subsidy regime in the oil sector when it came on board in 2015 but almost eight years after, Nigerians are still talking about the oil subsidy. Now, the President is requesting N2.5trillion for fuel subsidy, what is your comment on that?
Actually, we know part of that is a scam; some people just benefit from round tripping and fraud. I don’t think we consume up to 100 million litres of fuel every day; that is impossible. We don’t consume more than 50 million litres daily, but that is what they are saying. So, it is a racket and as you know, whether I am in APC or not, I am not in power in APC. So, you should take the question to the people in power. They will not give me power in APC; they won’t even give me a good job in APC because they know I am too straightforward.
Ahead of the 2023 general elections, the struggle for presidency is assuming a controversial dimension, with politicians from every geo-political zone declaring interest for the plum position. One of such aspirants whose aspiration has become so controversial is the APC National Leader, Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu. Some people said he is too old coupled with his failing health and that he should give way for the younger ones, but his supporters remain resolute that he is the best candidate to take the job. How do you see his aspiration to occupy the office of the president of Nigeria in 2023?
Actually, age does matter in leadership. Look at Indians; they always have old people as their leader. Even Joe Biden, the American President, is of my age or even one year older than my age, so that does not mean anything; it is capability that is the issue. I am an apostle of meritocracy but because of the Nigeria tradition; because of the diversity of Nigeria as a nation, I have always maintained that the presidency should be rotated. Normally, if you have a good leader, you don’t care where he comes from but because Nigerians are too tribalistic, my stand for now is that since the North has taken power for eight years, it should go to the South. And if the Northerners are saying that the Southerners have taken more years in this democracy, what of the military years, where people like Ibrahim Babangida took eight years; Yakubu Gowon took nine years, Murtala Muhammed, Sani Abacha, Muhammadu Buhari and all of them? How many years did they rule Nigeria as military leaders? So, people should not say that the South has taken more years because actually, the North has taken more years in leadership in Nigeria and as military dictators even. So, now it should come to the South. It can come from any part of the South; that’s it.
People of the South East are still saying and strongly so that the South-South and South West have had a shot at the presidency and that for equity, justice and fair play, it should go to the South East in 2023. Do you think the Southeasterners have a strong point here?
Nobody serves powers to people by that type of arrangement. So, the South East should be in a strategic position to gain power. I know that when Goodluck Jonathan was ruling, the Igbo had all the powerful positions in the country. Anyim Pius was there, Ngozi Okonjo Iweala was there and so were many of them. All the big positions in the country were held by the Igbo at that time; so we know all these things. They were taken because they were competent. So, this thing should be based on competence; it should come to the South because the Northerners have actually misused the presidency for the past many years that they had it. Some of us are not too happy with the way Buhari is using the presidency. It should not be a clannish, tribal thing; we want Nigerians who are altruistic and patriotic; not people who are too much ethnic in their disposition and action. It is not really fair that the president should have all the security chiefs from one part of the country; from even one tribe, ninety percent of them. That is unfair to other Nigerians; very unfair. Yes, I support Buhari but not in that aspect.
Looking at the APC’s performance in government so far, do you think Nigerians will be willing to vote for the party again in 2023?
Buhari is not the APC; I know that people have a lot of grievances against Buhari but the issue is that the economy was very bad when he took over. It was damaged by the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP); so I don’t have sympathy for the PDP. But, I know that if a good APC man takes over, he will turn things around. That is why I don’t believe in age but in competence; it is not by being a young person. Don’t you remember 1999, the beginning of this republic when we had young people like James Ibori, Donald Duke and others, who were jumping from London to Nigeria? They take their breakfast in London and dinner in Nigeria; that was what they were doing. The younger ones like life too much; I don’t trust them. I just want a wise, healthy man to run Nigeria; a healthy man who is not tribalistic, who is patriotic in all his doing.
The supper cop, Abba Kyari is currently enmeshed in drug deals and is already having his day with the National Drug Law Enforcement Agency (NDLEA). What are your thoughts on this development; are you surprised by the revelations so far about his underhand deals in drugs and other crimes?
Actually, Abba Kyari was somebody I love so much. I love him so much for cracking a lot of very deadly crimes but I never knew he had this ugly background; it is a pity. I pity him and I pity Nigeria; so we can’t get any good thing out of this country. When I saw the expose of what he did in all these areas, I wept over it. I was one of his fans actually because I love detective stories; I read detective books right from when I was in primary school. So, I was one of his fans. I think Nigeria should have a super cop like that but I never knew he was abusing himself. Immediately I saw that he was associating with people like Hushpuppy, I lost hope in him. And now, all these cocaine things are coming out; it is a shame.
How can we solve the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU)/Government face-off, which has become a perennial problem?
We don’t have very good negotiators for now. For 22 years when I was in the oil industry, every collective agreement was an agreement really and agreements are not cast in stones. If there are reasons to review an agreement, it could be reviewed by the two parties involved. And good unionists should not insist that every agreement should be cast in stone. If you are a unionist, you must look at the balance sheet of your employer. When I was negotiating for Shell and Chevron Oil Producers, I didn’t do the same negotiation for a service oil company. Even the marketers, I didn’t give them the same condition of service that I gave to the producing companies. The producers I know earn their money in dollars; the downstream sectors earn their money in Naira. So, people don’t joke with my collective agreement because I have my own sense and I sympathise with the employers as I sympathise with the workers; so we now strike a balance. That was how we negotiated, but in Nigeria today, many people go into negotiation without even getting real training. They don’t carry people along. When you negotiate, you carry your people along and you will see the facts. People should be educated. The Nigerian government just negotiates anyhow. They sign agreements which they know they can’t fulfill. That is the problem we have in this country. When you are negotiating, you dot the i’s and cross the t’s; you should know what you are negotiating and what you are signing and both parties should be truthful to themselves. That is why I was very successful in the trade union. A trade unionist and industrial relations company manager should be well educated on socio-economic issues because if you are not well educated, you can’t really negotiate clean agreements that will not be controversial. That is my view on that as an expert in that area.
As we march to 2023, what is your message to Nigerians particularly the electorate?
I have always believed in equity and justice and I believe that elections should be one man, one vote. Nigerian elections have not been free and fair; they rig it all the time. In the North, South, East and West, they rig elections. So, that has been the tradition in Nigeria. That is why they will tell you that three million voters registered in a state but during the election, you will see only about 400,000 and they will say low turnout. The whole registration was filled with fake names, so when it comes to physical voting, you don’t see the people. The Nigerian population and voting population is always exaggerated; we know that. If we really have a good digital, electronic voting like the Americans have, we will know the true number of Nigerians and true voters in Nigeria. All the people that have come to power in Nigeria have done so through those fake, fabricated numbers. So, let’s hope that we will keep improving; so I support electronic voting and it should be developed properly so that cheating will be removed from the Nigerian electoral process.