By Tunde Thomas
Bishop Kayode Williams was a one-time hardened criminal. As a dreaded armed robber, he reigned and ruled in the crime world in the 70s. In those days, the mere mention of his name was enough to send fear down the spine. But today, he is Director-General of Prison Rehabilitation Mission International (PREMI), a non-governmental organisation that has been involved in the campaign for the rehabilitation and reformation of prison inmates across the country for over two decades. In this interview, he spoke about his life, activities and a host of issues. They include the deplorable condition of prisons and what we can do to decongest them.
How did you come about your surname Williams, because it is uncommon for a Yoruba man to use an English name as a surname?
Our name, Williams, is historic. We are from Abeokuta in Egbaland. But some older members of our family told us years ago that we were originally from Sierra Leone. We are descendants of ex-slaves that were returned from the United States of America after the abolition of slavery. But originally we first settled in Lagos before moving to Abeokuta. The majority of our forefathers lived for a long time in Lagos, precisely in Igbosere, Isale-Eko area of Lagos Island.
As Director-General of a prison rehabilitation outfit, what do you think is wrong with our prison reformatory system?
It is good that the Nigerian Prison Service has now been changed to Nigeria Correctional Service. The impression that the word “prison” connoted before was that of punishment. It was as if the inmates were being sent there to be punished. But this is wrong because what should be the primary focus of sending inmates to prison is to reform them. This has always been the objective in other climes.
What has been your greatest frustration on the job?
It largely has to do with efforts we have been making over the years to let the authorities and other stakeholders see reason with us on the need to have attitudinal change about inmates. We have been trying to convince those concerned to shift focus primarily from seeing prisons as punitive centres to reformatory centres. The Correctional Centres should be turned into productive institutions where inmates can learn new vocations and also start producing items that in turn can fetch them money and also generate revenues for the government. This is the way they do it in other parts of the world. The revenues that accrue to the inmates would be given to them when they are leaving the prison. This, in a way will help them to start a new life.
What situation or incident can you recollect that made you shed tears in the course of your work?
I always find myself unhappy during visits to some correctional centres. Listening to stories of inmates who had been on awaiting trial for more than ten years upwards makes me cry. Some of these inmates are even women. I don’t feel comfortable when I listen to such stories. Why should someone spend 12 years without trial? This is very unfortunate and it is part of the reasons we need to carry out urgent reforms at our correctional centres. I have travelled to several correctional centres outside the country, and one can see the difference. We need to emulate nations like the United Kingdom, the United States, Holland and a host of others. We need to make our system work just as it is working in these other countries. In those nations, you can never hear such stories because their system is working. We need to ensure that our system is also working by ensuring that inmates are given fair treatment.
People complain about prison congestion. Can you share an experience with us?
Justice delayed, as they say, is justice denied. When you are holding somebody in the prison awaiting trial for years, this, in a way, contributes to congestion. I also discovered that, from my visits to the prisons, many of those being held on awaiting trial committed minor offences, which ordinarily should not have taken time for the judiciary to resolve. From my years of being involved in this project, I discovered that our judiciary system also has a crucial role to play in the decongestion of correctional centres. When you have trials of suspects running into years, then what you have is a situation whereby you have many inmates overcrowding facilities that are meant to accommodate a limited number of people. This has resulted to a situation where the number of awaiting trial inmates is higher than the number of actual convicts serving jail terms in correctional centres across the country.
What is the best way to address the issue?
One of the best ways is to speed up the prosecution of cases. In a situation where old cases are yet to be determined and new ones are piling up, then congestion will continue. Piling up of cases with endless adjournments, which usually result in people being remanded in correctional centres will continue to end up in congestion. To tackle congestion, the judiciary and the police should work harmoniously together because there cannot be diligent prosecution of cases without the two cooperating. The police should also ensure that they prepare their charges very well before taking suspects to court. The correctional centres should also be bold to write the judiciary about congestion whenever such a need arises. This way, the judiciary will be able to expedite action on the trial of cases.
Do you think that decongesting prisons can help us solve the problem of crime in Nigeria? If yes how?
Although decongestion of the prison will help, the major thing that we have to do to solve the problem of rising crime in the country is to address the problem of unemployment. A man or a woman that is not working, and doesn’t have a means of livelihood is a threat to the nation. We have to look for ways to engage millions of the unemployed in order to address the crime issue. In the country today, whether we like it or not, we must be honest enough that we are sitting on a keg of gunpowder as a result of unemployment. The situation is very explosive and government at all levels and other stakeholders must rise up to the occasion otherwise we are playing with fire. Unemployment is a big problem that is capable of leading to social upheaval if we fail to address it properly now. I believe that if we tackle the problem of unemployment, crime will reduce drastically because we can’t eradicate crime completely. There is nowhere in the world where crime can be completely eradicated.
In an interview some time ago, you revealed that people often call you to accuse you of spending the money you stole before you went to prison. Is that still your experience today or has the situation changed?
I don’t know how people came about that story because I spent 10 years in prison. Even before I was sentenced, there was no money anywhere again. Even the banking system at that time didn’t have provision for keeping loot or stashing away money to come back and start spending it. I’m talking of the ’70s. Anyway, in my own case, I didn’t have any money anywhere, and when I came out, I had nothing. Some people may be thinking that I made so much money when I was in the armed robbery world that by now I should be in money. But that is not so. I came out of Sokoto Prison penniless in 1980. But thank God I met Jesus Christ in the prison. This transformation led to my becoming a man of God. That was after I was released after spending 10 years in jail. There was no money anywhere when I left the prison. I had to start from scratch. When I left the prison, it was a university don, Prof Lawrence Kehinde of Obafemi Awolowo University, OAU that rallied some others to assist me to start a new life.
What other things do critics accuse you of? What are your responses to the accusations?
What I know is that there is no human being that people will not talk about, regardless of your status. Since I surrendered my life to Christ while in the prison, I have not looked back. My focus has been on winning souls for Christ. The other project in my life is prison reformation and inmates’ rehabilitation. I have been combining evangelism with the project. One thing I want to, however, caution Nigerians against is spreading unfounded allegations against people because it is damaging. What you are not sure is not true, don’t say it against others.
How can we deal with the problem of insecurity in our nation today?
Solve the unemployment problem, and the insecurity issue would be addressed to a large extent. The Federal Government should also continue to strengthen the armed forces by equipping our troops with sophisticated weapons to enable them to sustain the war against banditry and terrorism. We should also collaborate with other nations that are at war against terrorists and insurgents.
As an ex-robbery kingpin, have you ever been robbed, attacked or harassed by armed robbers before?
That was several years ago, around 1995. I was on my way to Akure in Ondo State to attend a programme organised by the late Papa Prophet Timothy Obadare. The renowned evangelist invited me as one of the guest speakers. But on the way, I was attacked by armed robbers who tried to snatch my car. However, on introducing myself by mentioning my name, the leader of the gang immediately saluted me. He then apologised on behalf of other members of the gang. Thereafter he ordered them to let me go. But he, however, begged me to let them have my wristwatch. I obliged them. It was an interesting episode I can never forget.
What is your advice to armed robbers, kidnappers, bandits and terrorists?
They should surrender now. They should realise that crime does not pay and that anybody that is involved should be ready to face the consequences. My advice to the Federal Government is that if these criminals failed to surrender, they should be annihilated. Under no circumstance should government negotiate with them. They have not only become a nuisance but also turned into a serious threat to the country. We should stop the idea of paying ransom to kidnappers, bandits and terrorists. By doing so, we are encouraging more people to take to kidnapping and banditry because of the huge sums of money they are making from the criminal act. To solve the problem, our security people should be on top of their game. Instead of paying the ransom, they should take the battle to the hideouts of the criminals and smoke them out. When they discover that it is no longer business as usual, they will have some rethink before going into crime. By paying ransom, it would look as if the government is weak or capitulating to the demands of the kidnappers or insurgents. Those so-called mediators or negotiators are also criminals. Government should have nothing to do with them.